Comments on: Polish election system for ex-pats gets my vote

By: Cherishing the Irish Diaspora « Moon Country

Cherishing the Irish Diaspora « Moon Country — Fri, 16 Sep 2011 11:16:20 +0000

[...] Ireland is a major global exception in that it denies its foreign based citizens the right to vote. David McWilliams compared this to the Polish attitude in a piece in 2007 which is worth reading and where you can spot a few comments I made at the time.2) International [...]

By: SHOULD IRISH EMIGRANTS RETAIN THEIR VOTING RIGHTS? « politicalreform.ie

SHOULD IRISH EMIGRANTS RETAIN THEIR VOTING RIGHTS? « politicalreform.ie — Wed, 22 Dec 2010 14:01:38 +0000

[...] element of truth in this. One commentator, “Bob”, responding to Economist, David McWilliam’s call for voting rights for emigrants, was adamant that, “Having lived abroad for six years, my view is that citizens abroad should not [...]

By: The Emigrant Irish - A Vote - The Irish Diaspora

The Emigrant Irish - A Vote - The Irish Diaspora — Sat, 20 Nov 2010 13:31:50 +0000

[...] Irish Post GlobalIrish.ie Independent.ie The Irish Times Amhrán Nua David McWilliams [...]

By: Seamus Moore 4/2/7 PEC

Seamus Moore 4/2/7 PEC — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 13:09:42 +0000

Excellent point, David. I am American-born of Irish immigrant parents and enjoy your commentary as you and your readers as the sole bastion of non-socialist thinking in Ireland. With regard to Poland, there isn’t a better country on the face of this earth that Ireland could look to for leadership on key issues. Despite all the suffering at the hands of others they have endured throughout history, their fighting spirit, zest for freedom and sense of national pride has endured. Their victory at the Battle of Vienna in 1683 stopped the Muslim conquest of Europe dead in its tracks. One hundred years later Poles were among the greatest heros in America’s fight for freedom from English tyranny. Too many Americans forget that Poland is oldest ally of America. The Poles value democracy so much because they had been denied it for so long. In summary, Ireland could do no better than emulating Poland on this or other issues. You may recall that Polish President Kacynski was given great “stick” for his response to the following question from a Sinn Fein TD from South Dublin at a press conference in the spring of 2007:
“Why didn’t you permit a gay pride parade in Warsaw in 2003 when you were the mayor?”
His response: “I believe that widespread promotion of homosexuality will lead to the elimination of the human race”.
Needless to say, progressives skewered him unmercifully for his “ignorant” and “neanderthal” comments.
Since gays cannot reproduce, he was spot on in his statement. The current “demographic holocaust” in Europe (read Mark Steyn’s America Alone) is certainly not helped by the gay agenda, although this agenda is certainly not the primary cause, witness Russia and Japan’s demographic collapse as well. The welfare state’s enervation of the individual is the primary culprit and Europe, of course is the home of the cradle to grave security blanket.

By: Noreen

Noreen — Wed, 14 Nov 2007 14:03:15 +0000

Bob, You may have developed a twisted view of Ireland while abroad, but I don’t think that’s a universal experience. Plenty of people who live abroad take advantage of the enormous variety of news sources on the internet and actually do keep up to date.

And plenty of people who live here couldn’t manage a conversation on Irish politics, or on any of the major issues of the day. It might be unfortunate, but we don’t require any sort of current events test for people who live here, so I don’t see how this is a legitimate argument against voting rights.

And frankly, I often think that plenty of my fellow voters here have a twisted view of this country as well – but unfortunately that has no bearing on whether they should be voting or not.

George, you’re so right – this is a basic thing that almost every other country in the world has managed – it’s getting embarrassing at this point that we don’t!

By: George Dillon

George Dillon — Sat, 10 Nov 2007 18:46:02 +0000

I think posters like Tomaltech are just ignorant. They are trying to defend a restriction which the great number of countries in the world do not have. Is everywhere else wrong, and Ireland right? Or does Ireland now look upon its people as worker-bees in an economy rather than members of a national family?

A lot of Irish people would sneer at Colombia’s credentials as a democracy. yet in the recent election for that country Colombia (no paragon of democracy, we are told) was able to organize voting for its citizens abroad. Yet narrow-minded people like Tomaltech think that Ireland couldn’t or shouldn’t do as well as a Third World country!

By: Bob

Bob — Fri, 09 Nov 2007 19:22:46 +0000

Having lived abroad for 6 years, my view is that citizens abroad should not be allowed to vote. They are not on the ground and have a twisted view of the country, as I had. When you come back as a returned immigrant you mostly don’t know what people are talking about.

Alternatively I think EU citizens at least should be allowed to vote in their country of residence, maybe after a 6 month waiting period. If you pay most of your taxes in a country you should be allowed to vote there – it’s only fair as those gobshites are going to spend your money so you should have some say in it.

By: Aidan Kelly

Aidan Kelly — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 19:20:45 +0000

Is there way that a legal case could be taken against the state for not granting non resident citizens a vote in Dail elections?

By: Noreen

Noreen — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 17:37:19 +0000

AM, I agree with you. There are lots of people living in Ireland who are less informed on the issues than some people who live abroad… In any case, most EU nations allow their expats to vote – It’s a shame Ireland is a standout on this one.

Lonely Expat, you wouldn’t need to trade your nationality for a vote. Ireland recognises dual citizenship – I can understand your reluctance to take on a new nationality but you wouldn’t need to give up your status as an Irish citizen.

Ireland also allows all immigrants, not just EU citizens, to vote in local elections – I think that this is a good thing, and we’ve had several African immigrants running in the last couple of local elections.

I doubt you’re missing anything on the doling out, but the Irish government has ramped up its spending to ensure the welfare of Irish emigrants abroad.

By: AM in Belgium

AM in Belgium — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 08:30:05 +0000

Lonely Expat: Like you, I cannot vote in either Irish elections or elections in my country of residence. I would love to be able to vote here in Belgium, but to do that requires becomming a Belgian citizen – which is quite pointless when both countries are EU member states.

Therefore, since I am an Irish citizen, I believe that I should be allowed to vote in Irish elections. I don’t feel I’m out of touch at all with the happenings at home. In fact, I’m probably more in touch now, and more interested and knowlegable than I was when I was living (and voting) in Ireland.

If the Irish government gave us ex-pats back our vote, then it would be up to the individual to decide whether or not they wished to use their vote. It should be individual’s choice and nobody else’s.

On the matter of granting immigrants the right to vote. Currently any EU citizen has the right to vote in European and local elections in their country of residence. However, it is a general rule that you must be a citizen of that country to vote in it’s general elections and referenda. The exception here is the agreement between Ireland and the UK.

Until the EU goes federal and stops being a collection of squabbling egomaniacs, the right to vote will not be granted to ex-pats or immigrants.

It is something I would like to see. It would certainly shake things up, and stop the politicians from the old-boys clubs from assuming that they will always be in power.